 Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 501 Tunesien |
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Original von Allen Dail
Hello Everyone
Nice new photo Mario. I notice a 501 tiger insignia on the front plate beside the jeep. It got me to thinking and I checked my books and photos I have of 501 tigers for tigers.
Could 2/501 be the only part of this unit to paint the insignia on their tigers. I Know panzer III ‘s had them painted on.
All I could find was 121 had a tiger and a name on the right side of the tank like 731 Norbert.
Which lead me to believe 121 and 731 might have been the same tank or at least its turret ended up on another hull.
But the side shot of 121 you cant quite make out the name. If it is Maus or Norbert.
I digress sorry, But the only tigers I seem to find the tiger painted on are. 833, 823,712, 241,243,231 which are all ex 2 company tanks and the front plate in the new photo.
Just another one of my theories, what do you guys think.
Also do we know any more signal corps numbers for this series of pics.
We have 175521 or 221 for the new pic 175564 and 176000 for this group of Tigers and 175517-175519 for the three by the railroad (823,833,and 111).
Allen |
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One of the staff Tigers had the unit insignia (stalking Tiger) on the same position. That Tiger is the only known not 2.Komp. tank with the insignia painted on the front plate.
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 502 Mai43 |
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Original von Chris Brown
Hi Hartmut,
The plugs are not readily visible in the resolution I can post here.
If you look here and blow it up to 200%, the one above the driver's visor you should see, it is on the join of the camo colours.
http://ground.warfarethroughthelens.org/...efehlstiger+502
Can I ask in what way the mantlets seem different?
Chris. |
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It looks not like a what you call "flat fronted mantlet".
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| Thema: 501 Tiger Verluste/losses in Afrika |
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Original von James Burns
The upended 243 turret in all likelyhood belongs to the Tiger which was blown apart with its wheels resting on both sides of the road near the M3 Tank Destroyer. The one on the other side of the PZIV on the roadside has its turret near the hull. |
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I don´t know wich one you mean.
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| Thema: 501 Tiger Verluste/losses in Afrika |
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Original von James Burns
That's what I was thinking David. Think you've discovered the fate of 243. Looks like they painted over the 2 and the 3, painted a little 8 over the 2 but went into battle before they could finish. |
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If i am not wrong, the renumbering on the 2.Kompanie Tiger was just made by overpainting the "2" with an "8".
All known renumbered 2.Kompanie tanks seems to confirm this and so this one should renumbered as 843.
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| Thema: 501 Tiger Verluste/losses in Afrika |
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Would be interesting from wich hull the turret comes. Actually it should be the turret of the hull near the Panzer IV on the field.
But he is a bit far from this hull.
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 506 43/44 |
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Original von Grant Hall
Hi,
From the background in the following pics, I've presumed that all photos were taken in the same location:
Which leads to be believe that these (ringed) gallery pics are not from the same location (and same pics in gallery for 2/Ko. '2').
So, are probably not 2/Ko. '2' and 1/ko. '13':
A closer look shows a lot of location differences;
Snow on the ground, on both sides of the river.
The water level is higher.
There's no trees or bushes on the river bank.
..and the crew positions/numbers/appearence don't appear to match either:
Also, in the 2nd pic above, we can see that '13' has rubber rimmed wheels, so a 'mid' production.
According to TIC1, the 506 were issued Tigers in Aug'43 and again at the very end of Jan'44.
So any 'mids' they had, would probably be of the very early type or the very late type.
The '13?' in the last pic doesn't have any rear end features of an early 'mid' (no pistol port, no 'feifel' brackets/mounts, and what looks like a 20t jack)
nor any late 'mid' features (mainly, no external travel lock).
I would guess that this 1/Ko. Tiger is an early 'steel wheeler'; 25mm roof/loaders hatch splash guard and what appears to be a turret ring guard (small pic), and no welded blocks on the rear hull.
Hope this is as clear as I think it is.. 
..and my apologies if it screws up the gallery.. 
Cheers,
Grant. |
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Hi Grant,
thank you for pointing this out. I couldn´t find the photos in question on my HD, but iirc i was the one who put it in the gallery as 2 and 13 from back view. Your thread shows it was a different location without doubts.
The serie of photos dos show more then one river crossings. In that region (can´t find in the mom where it was exactly) are many rivers and they are marching from one to the next. The fact that the river is not the same, means not automaticly that the marching order changed and we see other Tigers then 2 and 13 here. But on the other hand i have no point that these are 2 and 13 again.
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| Thema: 501 Tiger Verluste/losses in Afrika |
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Original von Allen Dail
John I think you are right about the tank you posted and the blown out mantlet one being the same tank.
It is just the weird angle that the photo of the soldiers looking in the turret from the hull.
We can't get a good match from the other two new photos. I believe it is too much of a coincidence of the angle and mantlet being blown out, not to be the same tank. |
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If the turret be the same, then it should share the same damages inside from the explosion. Right over the pistol port is a damaged metal band on the "new" turret, but on the other not. The turret on the "new" photo is resting close to its original postition but the other resting on the engines deck. The turret ring is blowing as an extra part out of the Tiger and thats just like we see him on the known Beja wreck near the Panzer IV.
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 502 42/43 |
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I am on the 502 photos again in the moment. By looking in to the gallery, there is Tiger 2 and Tiger 3 in a different time frame.
Just a small question: This photo shows both Tiger in the same time frame and photo serie. Should they not better located in the same time frame in the gallery too?
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| Thema: Unidentified Tiger I |
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Original von David Byrden
The combination of spare tracks on the turret, with a lack of a loader's periscope, is out-of-sequence and I recall seeing it only in 505.
David |
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Ithought too tis could be a 505 Tiger. The spare track holder on the front looks like 505 style and may we see a faded away unit emblem on the front plate.
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 505 43/44 |
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It is possible that the commanders hatch of every mid and late Tiger could be turned like this. I can imagine if the arm of the hatch were pulled in a overhigh position it could be turned around 360°.
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 501 Tunesien |
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Your pic dos not fully open but i think i know what it shows.
The pic is allready in my to do list, but i didn´t take it to the gallery so far.
Thanks
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 503 42/43 |
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Original von David Byrden
They are "324" because the turret box has "324" written on it. See "Tigers In Combat 1", page 182.
David |
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Thats a good explanation David!
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 501 Tunesien |
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Thank you very much for posting this!
And i think you are absolutely correct. I am convinced now that this is the wreck of Tiger 724(former 112)
great find mate
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| Thema: Ergänzung zur Gallerie 502/511 1944/45 |
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Patrick Agte in his Wittmann book tells that is a "LAH" Tiger in the Kursk battle......
Possible the infantery is "LAH" and thats why we found the pic in his book?
Thank you for the other matching pic! Tiger in the right looks like 222.
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